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Question on social etiquette and movement (warning maths) - WestGamer
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 12, 2014 11:10 am 
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There has been a number of times in game when I have had models in b2b and wanted to move one model to the direct other side of the second. The calculation for the distance is relatively straight forward and theres nothing in the rules that says you cant. However after two heated discussions when I tried to actually do it I just want to ask would people here consider it a breach of etiquette to do circular movement around bases?

I saw a couple of discussions on pp forums with no real conclusion (and I think they got their calcs wrong in anycase)




Math bit
Assumptions:
1 inch = 25.4mm
All movement comes from the front of the base of the moving model as per rules and stuff
base 1 is stationary. base 2 is moving
Distance from center of base 1 to front of base 2: ((radius base 1+ radius base 2)^2 +(radius base 2)^2)^0.5
This distance becomes the radius of the movement circle so the full distance would be: (radius * Pi)

This gives you the following distances from one side of a base to the direct opposite.
Base 2
Base 1 small medium large
small 4.15 5.0 5.83
medium 4.71 5.53 6.37
large 5.28 6.09 6.91

seems a lot easier to say 'I move x inches' than fiddling around measuring.

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 12, 2014 1:40 pm 
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Going strictly from the rulebook you can not move in a curved line. All model advances are in a straight line exactly forward, granted you are allowed to stop and turn as many times as you like but what you are proposing is an infinite number of miniscule moves and turns. So using radial geometry to justify moving your models is not strictly correct from a black and white rules perspective.

To me that is a side issue however the more important part is you need to measure, and your opponent needs to see you measure ALL model movements. This is a sportsmanship issue. Simply saying "I have enough movement to get around this base because math" doesn't cut it, you need to measure the movement on the table at the time. Physically the base of the model needs to move through the space on the table that it is advancing through and you need to measure that with a suitable measuring device. Similarly it doesn't matter if a player is able to accurately measure distance on the table by eye they still need to measure it out, doesn't matter if they are right.


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 12, 2014 6:51 pm 
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Quote:
Going strictly from the rulebook you can not move in a curved line. All model advances are in a straight line exactly forward, granted you are allowed to stop and turn as many times as you like but what you are proposing is an infinite number of miniscule moves and turns. So using radial geometry to justify moving your models is not strictly correct from a black and white rules perspective.

To me that is a side issue however the more important part is you need to measure, and your opponent needs to see you measure ALL model movements. This is a sportsmanship issue. Simply saying "I have enough movement to get around this base because math" doesn't cut it, you need to measure the movement on the table at the time. Physically the base of the model needs to move through the space on the table that it is advancing through and you need to measure that with a suitable measuring device. Similarly it doesn't matter if a player is able to accurately measure distance on the table by eye they still need to measure it out, doesn't matter if they are right.
Yeah I'm with Ross on this one. My geometry from high school isn't great and that isn't the sort of maths I would be comfortable doing in my head. If we were regular players together and it had come up and you sat down with me and showed me until the point I was happy with that and then next time you were like "remember the math" that is 3 inches (for example) I'm pretty sure I would be cool.

Certainly if we were playing timed turns I wouldn't be happy with that either, too much going on to confuse my troglodyte intellect with what appears to be basic high school math.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 16, 2014 11:53 pm 
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Cas

Hate to say it dude, your math is off.

But in any case...if we played a game, id be absolutely fine with circular movement as long as it didnt impinge game time. For me personally it wouldnt be a problem as the math is very straightforward. The only reason i dont have a problem with it is if we are using lasers to be precise for LOS purposes, laser cut dice and precision templates and measuring devices to be EXACT...if the math is known and can be demonstrated....why is this the one area to not be exact?

Below is the chart. Ive rounded off many of the decimals.

Image

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 17, 2014 12:13 pm 
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Either way, the potential is there to stuff it up if you bring maths like that into it. I agree with Ross' post too.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 17, 2014 12:35 pm 
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I'm of the mind that if you can't show it to me on the table, you can't do it.

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 17, 2014 12:39 pm 
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If someone has the correct math then I'm fine with it. It's like deviations that auto hit within a certain distance. I can't measure the exact distances with the precision required to know that, but it's a known fact that if your within 2" it can't scatter off - and people are happy to play it this way.

The math making sense is all I personally need.


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 06, 2015 11:54 pm 
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If you're willing to use your whole movement to do it then I'm ok with it.

If you're going to move there and then say "that's 5.5" so i've got 1.5" left to go" for some reason then that would probably be an issue.


In general moving small base to other side of small base I have no problem with. it's in the vicinity of 5". Whatever.


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