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Kings of War 2nd Edition Rules - Page 6 - WestGamer
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 12, 2015 7:08 pm 
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I prefer to view wavering as the last chance for survival rather than the turn before death. If a friendly unit can jump in and save the wavering unit from its enemies by routing the attacker then the near death unit can continue on to be a legit threat (all be it an easily dealt with threat, but a threat none the less) in later turns.

Casey and I found the use of inspiring quite interesting in our last game. She was using almost an entire army of lightly armored hordes while I was using almost an entire army of heavily armored regiments. Inspiring was great for me since units were only taking small damage at a time, and a spike in the dice could have been bad…..on the flip side I was dealing so many wounds to the hordes at once that there were either fine (due to huge nerve values), or routed on easy dice (due to so many wounds being inflicted). As such inspiring for me was worth every single point, but it didn’t help a single roll for Casey.


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 12, 2015 8:30 pm 
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Typically high armour value units have a lower number of attacks. It would seem to me that earlier on inspiring would be less valuable like you say. But saw you reduce them by 8 wounds in the first round of attacks, the second wave becomes much like charging a fresh regiment, though the value on the horde is much larger so the value of the inspiring increases too. It seems to me if inspiring was useless on the hordes it was either incredible luck or incredible play. I do see that as a good point though, regiments need the inspiring on any value of attack but its only a very powerful attack or the second and subsequent rounds when the horde requires the inspiring. For rats I can see this being less valuable because even then your hordes are not that valuable.

I can say though, you'll never see me without inspiring between my two 300 point hordes of elves. :shock: :shock:

( unless of course karl shoots it off the table with lightning. :roll: )


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 12, 2015 8:56 pm 
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Wavering doesnt really allow that kind of tactics seen as you can only pivot or move backwards. Typically the rest of your force just has to move on without them.
What I meant by my previous comment is that your should adjust your battleplans around a Wavered unit in order to anticipate your opponent's next move. For instance, moving a powerful Monster up behind a Wavering unit just might make your opponent think twice about trying to break that unit in his/ her turn. Similarly, you could move a pair of Regiments up beside the Wavering unit and threaten the opposing units flanks.

Waver is annoying for sure, but its certainly not about just casting the unit aside and saying "well, thats dead". A unit that Wavers is a tactical opportunity to change your opponent's mind from "im gonna smash that unit in my next turn!" to "do I really want to smash that unit in my next turn?"

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 12, 2015 9:09 pm 
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It seems to me if inspiring was useless on the hordes it was either incredible luck or incredible play.
I was playing Ratkin, so the best armour value in the army is 4. In my (albeit limited) experience with the rats, most Horde units are either not injured enough to care due to high Nerve values, or else hovering near death (with very little middle ground). Kills rack up quickly on the poor little guys, so its not uncommon for an elite unit with 12 attacks and Crushing Strength to be causing 6-8 Wounds a turn. When your unit is going from "you need a 10 to break me" to "you need a 3 to break me" in a single turn, Inspiring doesnt really do much.

Alternatively, as Karl pointed out, units with high Armour values and decent Nerve really do stick around when Inspiring is present (just cause your opponent usually isnt causing that many Wounds in the first place).

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 13, 2015 9:26 am 
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Quote:
Quote:
It seems to me if inspiring was useless on the hordes it was either incredible luck or incredible play.
I was playing Ratkin, so the best armour value in the army is 4. In my (albeit limited) experience with the rats, most Horde units are either not injured enough to care due to high Nerve values, or else hovering near death (with very little middle ground). Kills rack up quickly on the poor little guys, so its not uncommon for an elite unit with 12 attacks and Crushing Strength to be causing 6-8 Wounds a turn. When your unit is going from "you need a 10 to break me" to "you need a 3 to break me" in a single turn, Inspiring doesnt really do much.

Alternatively, as Karl pointed out, units with high Armour values and decent Nerve really do stick around when Inspiring is present (just cause your opponent usually isnt causing that many Wounds in the first place).
Going from needing 10s to needing 3s is not going to help but if your opponent needs 7s to break you and you have no inspiring they dont need to dedicate a unit to help break them. Doing one point at range still gives a good chance of routing the unit where if you have inspiring it means they do have to dedicate a bit more.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 13, 2015 10:37 am 
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Yeah exactly. I don't see how you really think you'll never need average dice to rout. It will happen alot.


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 13, 2015 12:13 pm 
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I think inspiring is essential because:

1. Stops those box cars extreme results.
2. If your moving forward a lucky waver from shooting can disrupt your lines and in this game you don't want disrupted lines as it opens flanks.
3. If you have a large unit get disrupted they can still move backwards I believe, allowing your chaff unit to interpose and therefore give your unit a turn to recover. Especially if they only took 1 wound and your opponent rolled box cars. I cant count the amount of times grind combats come down to who first fails the 50/50 nerve check.
4. Its especially crucial for road block hordes. Taking a 50/50 nerve check down to an almost guarantee is worth it my books for 50 points.
5. Also critical for those units in your list that do the heavy lifting to ensure they get that last charge off.

At present I am looking at 1 inspiring per 600-700 points in my list to provide my reliability and remove extreme results.


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 13, 2015 3:09 pm 
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Quote:
I think inspiring is essential because:

1. Stops those box cars extreme results.
2. If your moving forward a lucky waver from shooting can disrupt your lines and in this game you don't want disrupted lines as it opens flanks.
3. If you have a large unit get disrupted they can still move backwards I believe, allowing your chaff unit to interpose and therefore give your unit a turn to recover. Especially if they only took 1 wound and your opponent rolled box cars. I cant count the amount of times grind combats come down to who first fails the 50/50 nerve check.
4. Its especially crucial for road block hordes. Taking a 50/50 nerve check down to an almost guarantee is worth it my books for 50 points.
5. Also critical for those units in your list that do the heavy lifting to ensure they get that last charge off.

At present I am looking at 1 inspiring per 600-700 points in my list to provide my reliability and remove extreme results.
I believe double 6 is a waver and inspiring says you can only re-roll a route result.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 13, 2015 3:23 pm 
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Yeah double 6 is only waver unless it equal or exceeds your rout stat. (and you can't roll inspiring on wavers)


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 14, 2015 11:32 am 
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https://manticforum.com/forum/kings-of- ... 015-to-1-6

Not-Warriors of Chaos and Not-Lizardmen are now available in the beta files. :)

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 14, 2015 11:47 am 
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Thats not- cool.


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 14, 2015 11:53 am 
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Higher nerve, plus cool looking Marks... seems good to me :)

Interesting to see Bloodsworn (chaos warriors) are on 20mm bases, but that makes a 4x3 formation equivalent of a Regiment which is fine. Comparing Bloodsworn to orcs, the shield chaos warriors are just Ax orcs with better nerve and higher cost. The great weapon warriors are Greatax orcs that only hit on 4s instead of 3s but have better nerve, at basically exactly the same cost. The ability to take chaos marks definitely makes me happy to try these new rules :)

The Direfang riders (Skullcrushers) are only move 6 which seems a bit slow for cavalry but they put out a HEAP of attacks when they do go in.

None of the monsters fly or shoot, so no luck for my Chimera or Hellcannon models :( :( :(

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 14, 2015 12:49 pm 
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There's a lord on chimera for your flying needs :D


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 14, 2015 5:17 pm 
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Interesting warriors list thought they might get a daemon prince/abyssal fiend.

Also there seems a large variety of marauders.

Also if Bloodsworn are chaos warriors what are the sons of korgaan the equivalent off (maybe the 40mm WOC models that came out during end times).

Cave Trolls seem good and I am liking the troll king.

Blood crushers are different lots of attacks but speed 6. More like large infantry. The monsters are a little under whelming to be honest. Characters seem ok.


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 14, 2015 5:41 pm 
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Sons of Korgaan are i guess Chosen?? Theyre kind of crazy, really interested in a list of just regiment after regiment of those (probably with +1nerve)...

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